Middle Kingdom LifePerspectives on Living & Teaching in China
Comments, Feedback & Suggestions
Now that you have had a chance to read the guide online, we invite you to provide us with comments, feedback, and suggestions for improvements and future updates.
The guide has undergone numerous revisions since it was first published online, in no small part due to your feedback and suggestions. We encourage you to keep it up and to let us know what you have found to be particularly useful (or not).
MKL Team
March 2nd, 2008
Posted
on Sunday, March 2nd, 2008 and is filed under Feedback.
You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed.
You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.
Loading ...
From p. 57 of the guide:
I am a 63 year old retired and widowed professor of finite mathematics. I have no children.
I travelled to China six years ago for a one-week visit and have been here ever since. I began working at a top-tier university teaching both math and English.
About three months after I started working, my FAO made a big deal of introducing me to the deputy mayor of our city. I was wined and dined and flattered excessively. Then the requests for favours started rolling in. Before I knew it, I was being sent more than 100 pages of barely intelligible English for “emergency” copyediting on a regular basis. There was never any mention of compensation. The English was so poor, each document took several hours to complete.
In exchange for all my efforts, I was invited to the Spring Festival celebration and seated at the main table, along with the governor of the province, the mayor, and my “friend” the deputy mayor himself. Shortly after this event, the free work increased to the point where I had to finally refuse it. It was interfering with my commitments to the university. The deputy mayor was insistent and warned “You know this is for the government!” I replied that I did understand this and so too was my university work also for the government.
About a year later, I had a small legal problem resulting from a car accident . So I thought I’d give my good friend, the deputy mayor, a call. I’ll give everyone three guesses what his reply was to my emergency. He listened and sympathised, and in the end informed me that there was nothing he could to do.
I wish this guide had been available six years ago. Reading it would have saved me a lot of grief. Of course I naturally assumed that if I ever needed some consideration from his Honour’s office, I would get it immediately. What a fool I was.
Thank you MKL for this guide. It is long, long, long overdue.
Robert
Great job! Something like this is really needed by the FT community. Thank you.
This is a ‘must read’ for every foreigner thinking about coming to China to teach.
I know it was written by men but it would have been nice if you could have included some women teachers too for some of the sections. The section on dating was interesting to read and it confirmed things I’ve thought about with Chinese girls, but doesn’t offer any useful information for single female teachers.
But everything else was great! Maybe future updates can include sections that are written just for women by women?
Thank you for this!
The problem I have with the guide is that I am one of those foreigners the guide says shouldn’t be here, but I’ve been in China for over 3 years and am doing well.
I dropped out of college when I was in my sophmore year because of a family tragedy. I was really depressed, doing nothing and feeling sorry for myself, so I decided to give China a try. Because I am unqualified and moved to China after a “mismanaged life”, according to your guide I shouldn’t be here.
Yes, it was very tough in the beginning, and you are right that moving to China to teach without a degree while you are depressed is not very easy because of all the changes you have to deal with. I did feel worse in the beginning and I almost went back home, but I stuck it out and now I have a job that is much better than the first one. Next year I will have enough money saved to go back home and re-start my life. So it can be done.
My school is very happy with me and my students are also. I don’t see how the teachers with real degrees are doing any better than me. Just for the record.
I did mostly think the guide was excellent. The sections on culture shock and dating Chinese girls was spot on. It just seemed that guide was written against teachers like me especially the section on western colleages, which I think is strange because most of the teachers in China do not have degrees, like your guide says. I never lied though about who I am or pretended to be anything I am not, which I agree many do.
Anhuiguy, The guide never suggests that unqualified and inexperienced teachers should not move to China, but, instead, attempts to forewarn foreigners such as yourself against possible abuse and exploitation. The commonplace mindset among employers is that unqualified and inexperienced teachers have no choice but to accept whatever conditions are thrown at them, because they have far fewer options.
In addition, as you yourself stated, having to face the myriad of cultural adjustment issues, especially the first year, with a severe depression or other emotional baggage is extremely difficult and painful, to say the least.
We’re glad everything worked out so well for you.
Excellent guide!
Anhuiguy, there are many teachers in China who don’t have a degree and many of them are doing a good job here.
Many are not.
There are also a lot of teachers in China with a B.A and a TESOL qualification who are doing a good job.
Many are not.
There are EVEN teachers with M.A’s, PHd’s who are doing a great job.
And some them won’t be doing a great job either.
Because doing well here has far more to do with being actually able to live here, and live here happily. That is what the guide is really about (I suppose) and that is what probably 90% of FTs that come here are not able to do: enjoy it.
With regards to the guide:
1. Marriage can entirely change a teacher’s working situation and that might be worth a mention.
2. Salaries in the language schools have been going up a lot since 2006 and you might want to revise some of your numbers. 9,000+ for a newbie isn’t too bad and I have heard of this being offered in both Shenzhen and Changsha - in nice schools admittedly, but still.
3.If you are good at your job and can prove your worth beyond being just another warm body, salaries and benefits can be a lot better than is suggested in this guide. You have to be good at your job though.
4. A lot of teachers wouldn’t go near a school’s apartment and rent privately.
5. Your point about career ESL teachers is well made. The longer you do the job the better you get at it and consequently the better the schools will treat you. Those that come here for ‘just a year’ maybe getting some cultural experience but are also sentencing themselves to a lot of pain too. For everyone has to be exploited in their first year. But the long-haul guys often have pretty sweet deals (as I am sure the writers do) and the guide might have made some of the perks for sticking it out.
6. The public system works very differently to the language schools one and I suspect our writers have more experience of the public one.
Mr. Changsha, thank you for the thoughtful feedback. We agreed with you that the advantages of being married to a Chinese woman should be included and we have added such a unit (see unit 23.g Marital Advantages).
The salary situation is a tricky one. We do write that there is a lot of variability in salaries across provinces and even cities. We have revised some of those ranges, in regard to private schools, but we are also aware of reports of salaries actually decreasing, especially in the government university sector.
Thanks again for your considered feedback!
MKL Team
All I can say is WOW!!!!!!!!!!
The section on dating should be required reading of all western men before they arrive. I can’t believe this is free. With all the books I read before I came, nothing was as accurate and thorough as this!
Thanks alot.
PS. My friend said he was able to download a pdf version of the guide. Is that still available?
Michael, Revision 2.8, April 29th, of the PDF edition is currently being updated to reflect all the changes that have been made to the online version. The online version will always contain the latest changes, and the PDF edition will then follow suit.
In the future, the PDF edition will be available for download only to those who have contributed a comment that has been published (which includes you). That’s just our way of saying thank you for the feedback.
We’re hoping to have the latest version of the PDF edition finished within a week.
I found this guide to be extremely helpful and it saved me from making a big mistake with a recruiter. I was told foreigners cannot receive their work visas until after they have arrived in China!
Is there anyway you could create a mailing list to let readers know when there has been an update?
Thanks again,
Jerry
Great guide, very comprehensive. About moving one’s belongings, there is now a “house to house” service in most cities where they pick up all your stuff, put it on a truck and transport it to your new location, but that doesn’t include moving the belongings into the new apartment, so you have to coordinate that with another service. Some people prefer it because your belongings are only being handled twice under your supervision instead of being tossed on and off a train which often results in a lot of breakage.
This guide is incredibly informative. I spent a year in China (10 years ago) as an engineer. I really enjoyed that experience.
I have a daughter who may be interested in teaching English in China when she graduates from college. I have two questions.
1. How can she get the necessary training for teaching English? There are a number of organizations on the web which advertises some kind of training program leading to a certificate. I am wary because of some bad experiences I have read online. How can I tell which ones are legitimate? Are there some reputable ones?
2. We are Chinese-Americans. How much of a hinderance will this be for my daughter when she begins applying for teaching positions? I understand that the private language schools really want a “white face” to impress potential customers. Are the public universities and schools less sensitive to this issue?
Thank you.
Thank you for your feedback; we are glad you found the guide to be so informative. The following is our response to your questions.
1). In China, the TEFL (teaching English as a foreign language) certificate is considered sufficient for preparing new teachers for their position. Although there is no official body that monitors TEFL, industry standards state that internationally recognized TEFL courses should meet the following criteria:
a. 4 weeks in duration
b. Over 120 hours of training
c. Minimum 6 hrs of practice teaching
d. Input sessions on Teaching Methodology and Grammar
e. Continuous assessment throughout the TEFL course
It would also be a good idea to check whether the course is registered with the Ministry of Education or simply licensed to run as a local business. The principal instructor should have a minimum of six to eight years of experience. A very safe bet would be to check for TEFL and TESOL (teaching English to speakers of other languages) programs that are offered by local universities.
2) Although American-born Chinese do have a much harder time finding EFL positions in China (for the reasons we and you stated), the consensus is that many do eventually succeed especially if they focus on smaller cities and public schools (primary, secondary, as well as university). As you suggest, the greatest bias against Chinese-Americans will come from private English language schools, where concerns for the preferences of the parents will be the strongest.
Best of luck to your daughter.
This site is excellent - I’ll be recommending it to others, and linking it on my site. Thanks and well done.
Brilliant! I spent over 50 quid buying books about China before I found this guide. I could have saved myself a lot of money and wasted time if I had found this first. This guide has been more meaningful and helpful than anything I’ve seen before.
Thank you Middle Kingdom Life.
Cheers,
Nick
Excellent overview recommended to me by one who said it was of great use to them. I will be linking to it from our very popular article and resource site on teaching English overseas if that is ok with you.
Cheers,
Greg
Hi Greg,
We appreciate the feedback and please feel free to link to this guide on your site. If you send the link to your resource site to MKLTeam@middlekingdomlife.com, we will append it to our Internet Resource page as well.
This is a beautifully written, thoughtful, balanced and comprehensive guide for foreign teachers that should be required reading for anyone thinking about teaching in China. Brilliant and kudos!
Cheers,
Preston
I was searching high and low for information about traveling to China with my dog and I finally found what I was looking for here. Thank you for a wonderfully informative and helpful guide!
Debbie Miller
Sacramento, California
This is one of those rare gound zero reports that tells it exactly like it is without sensationalising or sugar coating anything. I’ve been in China 3 years and still learned a lot from this guide. Kudos and thank you.
I just finished up a degree in education and wanted to take a year off teaching in China before starting my master’s degree. I am relieved that I found your guide before accepting any job offers. I never would have thought about asking about such things as whether the foreign teacher housing had an elevator, what floor my apartment would be located on or whether the building had a backup generator.
I am still young but I suffered a serious injury to my knee while playing football in high school and having to walk up six flights of stairs would have killed me, and that is exactly where the apartment at this one school was located.
I now check this guide at least once a week for updates and am very grateful for the latest information. You don’t seem to be selling anything here so I guess you are doing this as a public service. I for one am very appreciative of your efforts and I know I am not alone.
Thank you Middle Kingdom Life for such a great resource and please keep it up.
Kind regards,
Brian Kempler
This guide is truly amazing. I bought 3 books about China at Barnes & Noble before I found this guide and the 3 books together don’t provide the level and quality of information this book does.
I made the mistake of asking a question about my contract on a teacher’s forum and I was so sorry that I did. Some people told me the contract was fair and others told me that they would never sign it. Then I found a link to this guide on a website (transitionsabroad.com –thank you!!) and my question was answered correctly in a matter of a few minutes (plus a lot more I hadn’t thought of).
The only thing I am wondering about is why the authors of this book have chosen to remain anonymous. If I was one of the writers of something like this, I’d want to be given credit for it. Wink.
Anyway, thank you so much and God bless!
Kimberly Anderson
We have received quite a few e-mails asking us why this guide is free and we’d like to answer that questions.
This guide was never intended to be sold: that never was the motivation behind its creation and that will never change. This guide represents the efforts of numerous contributors with one serving as the principal author for the sake of uniformity. Everyone who has been involved with this project had very painful and difficult experiences during their first years in China and that is entirely and precisely the reason this guide was created and published online for free: We are hoping to spare those who read it all the unfortunate experiences we had as a result of having arrived here without the benefit of reliable and accurate information—information specifically for foreign teachers written by foreign teachers.
Although Internet forums can be a good source of reliable information about living and working in China, as you point out, sorting the wheat from the whey can be both a time-consuming and futile task because, ultimately, there is no way to determine whose opinion is correct when you have no personal experience to base or judge any of the feedback on. Can a teacher live comfortably on 4500 yuan per month? Anyone who reads unit 4b in this guide should be able to accurately answer that question for him or herself, as you indicated in your post.
The reason we go through the trouble of referencing and confirming just about anything we can with external and authoritative sources is because we believe we have a commitment to substantiate every position and point we make in this guide. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but if that opinion is to be relied upon by others who will be making life-altering decisions, then it should be based on a lot more than just “what happened to me two years ago.” Conversely, to simply cite all remotely relevant laws and legislation that bear little or no semblance to what life is really like in China is certainly no more informative or helpful. Mainland China is not so much a land of laws as it is a country of complex interpersonal relationships as well as profoundly complicated economic and sociopolitical issues and sensibilities that change everyday.
Yes, Mr. Kempler, this guide was written as a “public service” and you have our word that it never will be sold. We are extremely gratified by the fact that in less than three month’s time, the guide has received enormous attention. Due to our almost overnight presence on Google.com, as well as on numerous EFL and expat websites, we are receiving a minimum of 50 to 80 unique visitors to the guide every day who are spending an average of 14 minutes reading 10 pages per visit (one visitor actually spent more than two hours on the guide in one visit reading literally every page).
We appreciate all the positive feedback as well as the overwhelming response to the new reader survey that was put up recently. All your suggestions are being considered and will be reflected in future revisions.
MKL Team
I imagine that there should be even more than just one person doing that. I have just spent the better part of the last 24 hours reading the wealth of information here (perhaps I read slow…), when my internet connection wasn’t disconnecting.
I have known people for years who have taught in China and tried to get me to do so. None of them, however, mentioned the potential race issue (I imagine because they would have had little reason to notice it). I am from the States, and of mixed black/white parentage. To what extent would this be a real issue, not just in finding a job, but in all the little things that you spend the rest of the day doing? I used to live in France and Spain, and the attitudes there by some of the people were negative up to the point when they realized, usually through my accent, that I was not from Algeria or Morocco, etc. From other sources I don’t gather that this is how it goes in China. What are the experiences of black people that go, either short- or long-term?
Thank you for an excellent guide.
Jamie DeSalu
Thanks for the feedback.
This is a very difficult question for us to answer. We have no first-hand personal experience with the issue and, even if we did, it might not reliably inform what you could expect anyway.
We know there are several non-native and, in some cases, non-white speakers from the Philippines, Germany, Spain, France and Nigeria who are teaching English in major cities, i.e., those heavily populated with foreigners, such as Guangzhou. So, at least from a vocational perspective, it is certainly possible for you to find a job in China.
As to what their day-to-day experiences are like with the locals, it’s very hard to say. However, most foreign teachers, such that they can’t speak fluent Chinese, tend to associate mostly with other foreigners—almost to the point of living in something of a vacuum. So we suspect that the real answer to your question lies in how well one’s foreign colleagues will receive you. People of color are not an unfamiliar sight to those who hail from Western countries so, in that context, your experiences might be just fine.
We suspect the predominant issue you will face is finding a job you actually want. If you have a degree, steer clear of private schools altogether and focus your efforts on public universities.
Best of luck to you.
I almost fell into the trap of coming to China on a tourist visa to work for a recruiter I really thought was a school and then I found this guide on another site for foreign teachers.
Thank you Middle Kingdom Life for this vital information. The Chinese government should make this guide required reading before they give you a Z-visa.
Denny
I am writing to thank the authors for all your efforts.
I have been following this guide since you first published it a few months ago and it just keeps getting better and better. The amount of information it contains is staggering and it is incredibly well written.
It is very hard for me to believe that poeple would devote so much of their time and expertise to preparing this type of information for people they don’t even know simply to do something nice for others.
It truly is unbelievable yet here it is. Like others said before me, your efforts and motivation are really appreciated by many, even if they don’t take the time to say so.
Thank you all so much.
Andrew Conners
This guide is a very important addition (and correction) to the information that is out there for many reasons. I think it is important that anyone thinking about “teaching English” in China understand that they will not really be teaching English.
As you point out, TEFL in China is big business and foreigners are simply viewed as overpaid employees. If you come here understanding the deal then it is manageable, but if you come here thinking that you are the Western answer to all their problems, you are in for a lot of disappointment and trouble.
Teaching job satisfaction in China comes entirely from the students (sometimes), not from the people who hire us. People thinking about teaching in China need to know this.
Great work!
Jason
This is a terrific guide, which I wish had been available when I came to China as a teacher. It has many of the most accurate and balanced articles that I’ve found Thanks for taking the time and effort to put this on the web.